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I was wondering if anyone had the latest versions of this. I'm working on a
breakdown right now, and it would help a lot if I had scheduling. If you have
it, IM me on AIM at Incendiaryfilm or send me an email at
With Nicholl, Austin, and other major contests coming up, I'd like to
assist you in having the best chance you possibly can at winning. So I've
created a special class that I'm delivering one-time only.
Its purpose is to make your first ten pages outstanding. That in itself
will increase your chances of getting into the second round by 50% or more.
Then it is up to the rest of the script to carry you through to the stage
to accept your award.
Even if you're not entering a contest, this will be a very valuable class
because those first 10 pages have a producer decide if they're going to
read even one page more.
Here's the scoop:
CLASS: Make Your First Ten Pages Shine!
PURPOSE: Increase your chance of success with producers and contests.
STRUCTURE OF CLASS:
Day 1: Understanding Great openings.
Day 2: Opening Events That Dazzle.
Day 3: The Necessary Structural Components.
Day 4: First Pages That Blow 'Em Away.
Day 5: Making your first 10 pages the best they can be.
Day 6 - 10: Critiques That Increase Your Depth of Understanding.
DATES: April 17 to 26th, 2003
Why would you want to take this class?
The first 10 pages shape a reader's opinion of your script more than any
other pages in the script...especially when they are only reading the first
30 pages for a contest. If your first 10 pages really shine, chances are
they'll feel good about the script from the beginning. So you want those
pages to be your very best writing.
MY PROMISE: The openings of every script you write from this point on will
be better because of the 10 days you spent in this class. And you'll walk
out with a better script to send to Nicholl or Austin.
To join the class, go to http://www.ScriptForSale.com/TenPages.htm
Hope you'll join us.
Does anyone know how to become a reader for either a production
company or an agency? Is this the type of job you need a contact or
is a job like any other where you can just apply and there is actually
a chance of getting the job? In fact, how much do readers make?
Would love to get in but don't know where to go.
All good questions I'd love to know the answers to. Would appreciate
any help at all from anyone at all.
Be sure and look for the hidden coupons! Should you have trouble
finding them alone, recruit your friends, there is a coupon worth
$15, you just have to scroll the cursor around until it turns into a
hand, and then click. The first one is located under the title on
the homepage, happy hunting and thanks for making this a great first
year. The contest will begin again in October, right after our
kickoff celebration with a live staged reading by the Script factory
U.K. here in LA, with a script from the contest!!! See you at the
There are three major contest deadlines coming up -- Nicholl on May 1st,
Austin on June 2nd, and Chesterfield on June 21st -- and a bunch of smaller
contests. If you're entering any of these, you need every advantage you
To find out what it takes to win these contests, we interviewed 11 contest
winners, readers, and contest directors from contests like Nicholl, Austin,
Final Draft, Moondance and others in the last month.
Out of those interviews, we created an article and a list of 51 Tips for
succeeding at contests that came from our "contest experts."
You can see the article at http://www.ScriptForSale.com along with
instructions for downloading the "51 Tips" that go out to subscribers of
our free newsletter.
If you haven't won a contest yet, you'll find this to be valuable.
Just thought I would tell all my sci-fi novel, THE GAIA SYNDROME made
the publishers best sellers list. Have a new sci-fi novel out titled
THE OTHER STORY. Abiather films optioned my comedy screenplay IT'S
NOT OVER TIL. Have a great life one and all.
For the most part getting a reader job takes having a contact at a
studio, at least as I understand it. Now the next question everyone
is going to ask is "well, how the hell do I make contacts?"
It's simple and complicated--get yourself out there. Send out
scripts (polished scripts) to everyone. Make people notice. When I
first joined this group a few years ago I had nothing and now I have
some pretty solid people looking out for me. It pays to network any
way you can. And I mean ANY way you can.
Now obviously that's easier said than done, but you get the drift.
Send me an email and we can discuss some options.
Just thought I'd check in to see what everyone is doing. I know Love
had posted a while back about his script going into production. What
about everyone else?
I am getting my shit together and starting to write a real script
again. I always make a point to do some kind of writing, but had
slacked in the script department recently after the last one I wrote
got shelved for a bit. I figure I need to get one done and polished
plus one more for when I make my way out to LA towards the end of the
year/beginning of next. It helps to have goals :)
Being that I work the highly glamorous job of Timeshare Salesman,
I've been afforded a virtual smorgasboard of script ideas just at my
resort. I'm therefore planning a script around my place of business,
so everyone keep your fingers crossed that when it's sold they decide
not to sue me. I'm actually using that setting to tell the story of
a historical character in a modern context. And besides, if you've
ever been to a Timeshare tour you KNOW there's a story behind every
Hope all is well with...well, all.
I am an entertainment attorney in Los Angeles, California. I currently
represent a screenwriter named Tracy L. Morris, who has written an urban
dramatic feature screen- play with a backdrop of the business of professional
football. The script has been submitted to Queen Latifah for production
consideration. I have included the synopsis.
I am seeking legitimate and credited producers who have access to talent,
financing and distribution (preferably, with a "first-look" deal with a
studio), who would be interested in this type of project. If that is you, or,
a someone you know, I can be reached at the number(s) below.
William A. Brown, Jr., Esq.
(213) 387-0661 (Office)
(213) 387-0884 (Fax)
(213) 910-5550 (Cell)
Out The Blue
By Tracy L. Morris
"When life throws a curve to a football team owner and his family, the
results affect them and those that they love in ways they never thought
Owen Chandler, the Owner and active General Manager of the professional
football team, the Los Angeles Knights, concludes that the time he spends
working at the family business far exceeds that which he spends at home with
his ailing wife Mallory. As home health nurse, Danielle Kirby, strives to
maintain Mallory's well being, and that of her own family, she silently
grieves the death of her baby daughter -- A loss that has driven her husband
to the open road.
When Victor Clayton, team liaison for the L.A. Knights gets wind of Owen's
pending and ultimate decision, he determines to have it all -- by any means
necessary. His "react first-think never" approach to life and business
proves to be a detriment to himself and to those in his wake.
After having graduated from LSU, and taking a little time off, Danielle's
nephew, Bryan Upshaw, an upstart sports agent, and his girlfriend/busi- ness
partner, Rachel Shepard, relocate to Los Angeles. Soon after, their client
list is plagued with top prospects such as, the young phenom Marquis Zeno,
Trent "Deep" Bridgewater, Evan Eddins, Reggie Street and Ramsey Pardue. The
couple couldn't be more content if they triedβ¦ That is, until Bryan is
thrust out of his comfort zone and into circumstances beyond his control,
which ultimately puts their relationship, and plans to the test.
As the professional and personal lives of Owen, Mallory, Danielle and Bryan
intertwine, their decisions result in a chain of events that will alter the
course of their lives."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
If I see another log line that finishes up with, "...that changes the
course of their lives forever," I'm going to puke.
Log lines are about being direct and specific, not like the vague
ending shown above. If you can't write a proper log line, then what
good are you to a producer or production company?????
And no I'm not going to explain it to you. You have the whole
Internet to answer that question. Do your research and get it right
instead of wasting everyone's time.
I, Fitz, do hereby declare this club, er.. "group", dead. It is a
tragedy, really. A club so full of life and energy... and 8 balls.
Why, Yahoo? Why? Why did you chain us to the "Groups"? That
marked the beginning of the end for the HC.
But like Jonathan, I too feel chastized... we moderators are guilty
of letting it all slip. Not that we have control over anyone's post-
rate, but back in the day someone (Luke) would always find some post
to get people riled up.
Geoff, you are absolutely right... many of the old timers have moved
on- either to the industry or elsewhere. We'd like to post more
often, but who has time anymore?
What can be done to revive the beast? Membership is still high and
this is a solid group of people- been reading great posts lately.
Perhaps the creature is re-awakening!!! It's alive!!! Alive!!!
Jonathan, you said it all regarding the Robert McKee seminar. Wish
I had just bought the damn book for $25. All the info is in there.
I swear, if he had retold one more damn scene incorrectly I would've
turned on my cell phone just to be thrown out of the room- if you're
going to quote from Empire Strikes Back, at least get it right.
Plus, for our money we were treated to several speeches on his
personal political views. Granted I agree with some, but who cares
for $500!!! Gimme somethin' I can use!!!
Enough on that sore subject.
What's going on lately is the issue at hand... I see some great
posts from members making their way into the biz. I love to see
As for me, Jonathan and I are working together on a script- entering
into rewrite phase. Neither of us have ever collaborated before,
and it's been great... though difficult at times considering he
lives in Northern CA, and I in Southern CA. Somehow it all works
out. Can't give a lot of detail at this time because the producer
attached might decide to kick our collaboratin' arses if we spill
I'm also rewriting one script as well as preparing to start on a
The pilot I completed last year is finally gaining some momentum,
getting represented by someone good now. I'm not holding my breath
for anything to come of it- it's really quite bad!!! hahaha! But
with what is on the tube these days, who knows!
Hope this post finds everyone happy, healthy, and makin' it happen!!!
Talk to the 8 ball.
--- In email@example.com, johnnywildcard
> Well, well, well... I will consider myself officially
> Geoff, as always, good to hear from you. Like you, I've been
> lurking for forever now (have stray Camerata messages sent to my
> email), but getting back on the club horse would be another thing
> entirely. So many have gone their separate ways, it seems.
> the occasional post - lotsa spam. But these days, for me, I think
> I'd have a hard time pretending I know what I'm talking about
> But yes, the club can only be as good as its community and
> And we've pretty much let it fall by the wayside. Maybe it can
> back some day. Who knows?
> But hey, why not post a little sum'n sum'n for old times sake? I
> sometimes miss it, that's for sure.
> So Fitz, Dark and I had a good time in LA this last weekend. Went
> to the Robert McKee STORY seminar and felt officially ripped off.
> Okay, in my ever-so-humble opinion... Unless you are completely
> uncomfortable or otherwise unfamiliar with the basic concepts of
> story and screenwriting, save your money. There was nothing that
> pompous balloon-head said that hadn't been said a hundred times
> before by far lesser - and by that I mean lesser expensive,
> specifically - people.
> Three full days for the seminar. Yet the amount of useful info
> could be garnered in but one day, I think, and that would still
> leave plenty of time for McKee to retell the complete plots of at
> least 50 movies in entirely unuseful ways.
> I'm being a tad harsh. I came away with a some useful info, and I
> got to chill with the guys and sleep on Fitz's floor. Gotta love
> that. Plus, I learned I should be writing on a yellow legal pad
> instead of a white one if I want to "make it".
> But seriously, $500 for 3 days is too much for not enough. It
> worth it. While the guy has very good presence and is an
> speaker, it just wasn't for me. The man likes to tell stories,
> that's pretty much exactly what you pay him to do. It's 3 days
> for a reason - he tends to get off on tangents. At one point, we
> outlined a four act tangent that never managed to get back on the
> original subject. Something about Basic Instinct and the French
> But if anyone insists on attending the seminar anyway, make sure
> keep you mouth shut and turn off your cell phone.
> --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, goosejmu22
> <no_reply@y...> wrote:
> > Damn it's been a while.
> > I would suggest to everyone that has joined the club in the last
> > to go back and read through some of the posts from other times
> > the club was hopping. Back when it WAS a Club--before Yahoo!
> > switched over to this terrible Groups crap.
> > Man was this place great. The only reason that it has suffered
> > because so many of us have gone on to do...to perform...well, to
> > life. Some in the "industry", some not. It was almost
> > devoid of advertising, chalk full of good debate, and run by
> > who were willing to lend a helping hand to those of us getting
> > started in this business. I know I would not have my most
> > entertainment industry contacts had it not been for the
> > The Club fell apart because we allowed it to. Well, perhaps
> > is a bit violent of a term--we all had our good reasons to let
> > posting rate slip. Some of us got busier jobs, more kids, or
> > houses. Some of us just stopped trying.
> > What you new guys have here is the potential for a great
> > build upon. I know there are some people lurking here--God
> > have been lurking for a good six months or so now--that have
> > knowledge or questions. Post it all. Get some conversations
> > Tell your friends who are interested. That's how hte
> > got started. All in all, it fizzeled because the people at the
> > became too successful--really.
> > I'm here to help get you started. Anyone of the other old heads
> > still out there? Fitz? Johnny? Flight? Splatt? (GULP)
> > Poppi? Love (I know I saw you post a few weeks ago)?
> > Get invovled. I would love to see us help each other the way I
> > so many others have been helped so far. It is because of this
> > and I mean this sincerely--that I am on my way to make my mark
> > Hollywood in the near future.
> > Now you all get on the ball too, dammit.
> > Talk to the Eight Ball,
> > Geoff
Wow, Geoff, it was great to see my name among the ones you mentioned!
This is the first time in a long while that I've wandered into Groupsville.
so bad about not being part of the old club for so long. I wish I could say it
was for reasons of success!! :) I'm still mucking my way through this myre of
post-production, working freelance in corporate video (woo-hoo) and
involving myself in projects here and there.
Truth is, I've felt like the wind wasn't fully in my sails since losing contact.
was always inspiring and supportive to read the posts of everyone going
through, or even just starting, the same processes I was going through. I've
missed that greatly.
Like an idiot, I've been waiting for the promised Groups panel on my Yahoo!
homepage to actually show me message updates! May as well wait for a film
version of Don Quixote. I'll have to go in and adjust the e-mail settings and
get updates that way. That does work, I'm assuming?
By the way, happy birthday, Bob Hope. 100 years old on Thursday. A great
inspiration to me and generations of comedians.
--- In email@example.com, it_fitz <no_reply@y...>
> Dear Cameratites,
> I, Fitz, do hereby declare this club, er.. "group", dead. It is a
> tragedy, really. A club so full of life and energy... and 8 balls.
> Why, Yahoo? Why? Why did you chain us to the "Groups"? That
> marked the beginning of the end for the HC.
> But like Jonathan, I too feel chastized... we moderators are guilty
> of letting it all slip. Not that we have control over anyone's post-
> rate, but back in the day someone (Luke) would always find some post
> to get people riled up.
> Geoff, you are absolutely right... many of the old timers have moved
> on- either to the industry or elsewhere. We'd like to post more
> often, but who has time anymore?
> What can be done to revive the beast? Membership is still high and
> this is a solid group of people- been reading great posts lately.
> Perhaps the creature is re-awakening!!! It's alive!!! Alive!!!
> Jonathan, you said it all regarding the Robert McKee seminar. Wish
> I had just bought the damn book for $25. All the info is in there.
> I swear, if he had retold one more damn scene incorrectly I would've
> turned on my cell phone just to be thrown out of the room- if you're
> going to quote from Empire Strikes Back, at least get it right.
> Plus, for our money we were treated to several speeches on his
> personal political views. Granted I agree with some, but who cares
> for $500!!! Gimme somethin' I can use!!!
> Enough on that sore subject.
> What's going on lately is the issue at hand... I see some great
> posts from members making their way into the biz. I love to see
> As for me, Jonathan and I are working together on a script- entering
> into rewrite phase. Neither of us have ever collaborated before,
> and it's been great... though difficult at times considering he
> lives in Northern CA, and I in Southern CA. Somehow it all works
> out. Can't give a lot of detail at this time because the producer
> attached might decide to kick our collaboratin' arses if we spill
> the beans.
> I'm also rewriting one script as well as preparing to start on a
> The pilot I completed last year is finally gaining some momentum,
> getting represented by someone good now. I'm not holding my breath
> for anything to come of it- it's really quite bad!!! hahaha! But
> with what is on the tube these days, who knows!
> Hope this post finds everyone happy, healthy, and makin' it happen!!!
> Talk to the 8 ball.
> Brian "itfitz"
> --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, johnnywildcard
> <no_reply@y...> wrote:
> > Well, well, well... I will consider myself officially
> chastized! :)
> > Geoff, as always, good to hear from you. Like you, I've been
> > lurking for forever now (have stray Camerata messages sent to my
> > email), but getting back on the club horse would be another thing
> > entirely. So many have gone their separate ways, it seems.
> > the occasional post - lotsa spam. But these days, for me, I think
> > I'd have a hard time pretending I know what I'm talking about
> > anymore.
> > But yes, the club can only be as good as its community and
> > And we've pretty much let it fall by the wayside. Maybe it can
> > back some day. Who knows?
> > But hey, why not post a little sum'n sum'n for old times sake? I
> > sometimes miss it, that's for sure.
> > So Fitz, Dark and I had a good time in LA this last weekend. Went
> > to the Robert McKee STORY seminar and felt officially ripped off.
> > Okay, in my ever-so-humble opinion... Unless you are completely
> > uncomfortable or otherwise unfamiliar with the basic concepts of
> > story and screenwriting, save your money. There was nothing that
> > pompous balloon-head said that hadn't been said a hundred times
> > before by far lesser - and by that I mean lesser expensive,
> > specifically - people.
> > Three full days for the seminar. Yet the amount of useful info
> > could be garnered in but one day, I think, and that would still
> > leave plenty of time for McKee to retell the complete plots of at
> > least 50 movies in entirely unuseful ways.
> > I'm being a tad harsh. I came away with a some useful info, and I
> > got to chill with the guys and sleep on Fitz's floor. Gotta love
> > that. Plus, I learned I should be writing on a yellow legal pad
> > instead of a white one if I want to "make it".
> > But seriously, $500 for 3 days is too much for not enough. It
> > worth it. While the guy has very good presence and is an
> > speaker, it just wasn't for me. The man likes to tell stories,
> > that's pretty much exactly what you pay him to do. It's 3 days
> > for a reason - he tends to get off on tangents. At one point, we
> > outlined a four act tangent that never managed to get back on the
> > original subject. Something about Basic Instinct and the French
> > abortion...
> > But if anyone insists on attending the seminar anyway, make sure
> > keep you mouth shut and turn off your cell phone.
> > Cheers,
> > Johnny
> > --- In email@example.com, goosejmu22
> > <no_reply@y...> wrote:
> > > Damn it's been a while.
> > >
> > > I would suggest to everyone that has joined the club in the last
> > year
> > > to go back and read through some of the posts from other times
> > when
> > > the club was hopping. Back when it WAS a Club--before Yahoo!
> > > switched over to this terrible Groups crap.
> > >
> > > Man was this place great. The only reason that it has suffered
> > > because so many of us have gone on to do...to perform...well, to
> > live
> > > life. Some in the "industry", some not. It was almost
> > > devoid of advertising, chalk full of good debate, and run by
> > > who were willing to lend a helping hand to those of us getting
> > > started in this business. I know I would not have my most
> > important
> > > entertainment industry contacts had it not been for the
> > BDC/Camerata.
> > >
> > > The Club fell apart because we allowed it to. Well, perhaps
> > allowed
> > > is a bit violent of a term--we all had our good reasons to let
> > > posting rate slip. Some of us got busier jobs, more kids, or
> > > houses. Some of us just stopped trying.
> > >
> > > What you new guys have here is the potential for a great
> > to
> > > build upon. I know there are some people lurking here--God
> > I
> > > have been lurking for a good six months or so now--that have
> > > knowledge or questions. Post it all. Get some conversations
> > going.
> > > Tell your friends who are interested. That's how hte
> > > got started. All in all, it fizzeled because the people at the
> > top
> > > became too successful--really.
> > >
> > > I'm here to help get you started. Anyone of the other old heads
> > > still out there? Fitz? Johnny? Flight? Splatt? (GULP)
> > > Poppi? Love (I know I saw you post a few weeks ago)?
> > >
> > > Get invovled. I would love to see us help each other the way I
> > and
> > > so many others have been helped so far. It is because of this
> > club--
> > > and I mean this sincerely--that I am on my way to make my mark
> > > Hollywood in the near future.
> > >
> > > Now you all get on the ball too, dammit.
> > >
> > > Talk to the Eight Ball,
> > >
> > > Geoff
Yes, there's a way to adjust your Group settings so you can receive
new messages via email. Click Edit My Membership on the homepage,
then select individual message delivery, or daily digest or whatever
your fancy. Not too many messages are sent out because, of course,
not too many new messages are posted.
And now to be topical, I will spill into a long, meaningful and
opinion-laden dissertation on why I hated the Matrix Reloaded...
Oh, never mind. :)
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, flight_finger
> Wow, Geoff, it was great to see my name among the ones you
> This is the first time in a long while that I've wandered into
Groupsville. I've felt
> so bad about not being part of the old club for so long. I wish I
could say it
> was for reasons of success!! :) I'm still mucking my way through
this myre of
> post-production, working freelance in corporate video (woo-hoo) and
> involving myself in projects here and there.
> Truth is, I've felt like the wind wasn't fully in my sails since
losing contact. It
> was always inspiring and supportive to read the posts of everyone
> through, or even just starting, the same processes I was going
> missed that greatly.
> Like an idiot, I've been waiting for the promised Groups panel on
> homepage to actually show me message updates! May as well wait for
> version of Don Quixote. I'll have to go in and adjust the e-mail
> get updates that way. That does work, I'm assuming?
> By the way, happy birthday, Bob Hope. 100 years old on Thursday.
> inspiration to me and generations of comedians.
I didn't like it either...
Especially the end.
June 1st, Digital Movie Company Prelude2Cinema is launching "The
Indie Reporter," an on-line movie magazine that will be giving a
voice to true indie movies and stars. Each issue will be $3.50 and
completely on-line. The magazine will also be accepting Maxim style
photos from up and coming models and actors. As a special for Members
of the hollywoodcamerata Yahoo Group, they can get the premiere
issue for $2.50 by going to
To see the cover for the June issue of "The Indie Reporter," go to
The magazine will feature news on Director Jim Friedman who has 50
Emmys; "teaser" model and actress Vanessa Heart; behind the scenes on
the TV Series "Out of Darkness"; and more on true indie movies and
The Indie Reporter will be completely on-line and change throughout
the month. We will also add links to movie clips and sites. So, if
you have news for The Indie Reporter, make sure to send it to us.
After a member subscribes, they will receive a password for the site
and that month's issue. Since this is the only way we have to secure
the site, please have tell no one your password.
Remember to get the special intro price, go to
Ha, Jonathan! I've heard your Matrix Reloaded rant- bring it. I
liked the film, but found myself irritated by it at the same time...
kinda like when you scratch a really bad itch.
It's been ages since I've spewed the digital page with my "Why
MAGNOLIA is the worst film of the last decade" speech... don't make
me pry open that Pandora's box again!
Hey, wait! This is 2 posts in 2 days... damn traffic jam here! LOL
Everyone, if you feel inclined... drop the group a post on what you
feel is the worst film in recent memory and why!!! This ought to be
"Ray... the next time someone asks you if you're a god, you say YES!"
--- In email@example.com, johnnywildcard
> Yes, there's a way to adjust your Group settings so you can
> new messages via email. Click Edit My Membership on the homepage,
> then select individual message delivery, or daily digest or
> your fancy. Not too many messages are sent out because, of
> not too many new messages are posted.
> And now to be topical, I will spill into a long, meaningful and
> opinion-laden dissertation on why I hated the Matrix Reloaded...
> Oh, never mind. :)
> --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, flight_finger
> <no_reply@y...> wrote:
> > Wow, Geoff, it was great to see my name among the ones you
> > This is the first time in a long while that I've wandered into
> Groupsville. I've felt
> > so bad about not being part of the old club for so long. I wish
> could say it
> > was for reasons of success!! :) I'm still mucking my way
> this myre of
> > post-production, working freelance in corporate video (woo-hoo)
> > involving myself in projects here and there.
> > Truth is, I've felt like the wind wasn't fully in my sails since
> losing contact. It
> > was always inspiring and supportive to read the posts of
> > through, or even just starting, the same processes I was going
> through. I've
> > missed that greatly.
> > Like an idiot, I've been waiting for the promised Groups panel
> my Yahoo!
> > homepage to actually show me message updates! May as well wait
> a film
> > version of Don Quixote. I'll have to go in and adjust the e-
> settings and
> > get updates that way. That does work, I'm assuming?
> > By the way, happy birthday, Bob Hope. 100 years old on
> A great
> > inspiration to me and generations of comedians.
> > --Flight
MATRIX RELOADED RANT W/ VERY MILD SPOILERS*******************
First of all, I don't care, I thought it was fucking great. I
thought the fight scenes were trememndous. I thought the story
progressed in a way I liked though it was not necessarily the way I
wanted it to. I was impressed by most of the special effects.
I DID have two major problems with the film: one was that they could
have had more story and less action. I would have been OK with fewer
fight scenes and more narrative. Most people who complain about the
plot are concerned with WHERE the story went. I'm concerned with HOW
it went where it went. I know they were trying to be cryptic and
metaphorically symbolic, but they could have been less sloppy. In
the scene where they were talking to the guy about getting the
Keymaker, they went over the same fucking 20 times and just said it
20 different ways. Please stop (Side note--If I hear one more person
laugh in a movie theater because they thought the guy was called
the "MerrilLynchian", I will shoot them). That said, I thought the
way the story tied into the architect was brilliant.
I also HATED the scene where he fought the 1,000's of Smiths. Well,
let me rephrase--I hated the five minutes of it that looked like a
computer game, because at points it looked really, really fake. With
all the other scenes so well done this disappointed me.
Also, Monica Belluci is invited to bang me senseless at any time.
All this in mind, I finally got around to seeing "Mulholland Drive"
last night for the first time. Let me set this up for you:
I'm a pretty smart kid. I did well in college. Got good SAT
scores. I get symbolism and hidden meaning. I enjoy films that make
me think and are kooky for the sake of provoking debate. I liked and
(for the most part) understood "Twin Peaks" and "Blue Velvet".
That said, FUCK YOU, David Lynch. This movie was a horrible,
horrible effort to seem "cinematique" and psychoanalytic. It's just
awful. I'm telling you this much: the people who said they
understand it and claim to love it to pieces are absolute liars.
They are grandstanding because they don't know what the movie was
about but are afraid that if they admit to it they seem less academic
This movie is a meandering, confused, pointless acid-trip. The
symbols and refernces are so vague and ridiculous that few can be
interrelated to the overall context or meaning. There is a very
faint theme that reveals itself at the end, but this film could have
been just as weird and done so much better. All I could think while
I was watching it was that it was like one of those "works of art"
done by some abstract artist. You know the one, they hang it on a
wall in a gallery, it has no aesthetic value, but it's just so odd
that people feel they need to talk about it or other people around
them will think they aren't contemporary enough to understand modern
art. Someday I'm going to walk into an art museum, crap into a soup
ladle, set it on a pedestal and ask someone at random what they think
the ladle represents. That will be the equivalent of what Lynch did
with this film.
Bergman, Fellini, Hitchcock, they worked with metaphor and symbolism
because it all had meaning and, however off-the-wall their symbols
might have seemed most had a good explanation or personal
verification. "Mullholland Drive" is at best dyslexic filmmaking and
at worst the most misspent $15 million ever.
By the way, I'm no critic and I'd say I enjoy 90% of the films I see,
but I'm just mad I wasted two and a half hours of my life on this
PS--If you liked "Mulholland Drive" good for you. I read David
Lynch's explanation of the symbols in the film and I WILL go back and
watch it again. Therefore, if you choose to repsond to this strign
of thoughts please do so, but without saying "You need to go back and
watch it again." Because I don't.
A recent quote from one of my favorites, Vince Vaughn--who is filming
a movie in Europe--on the US's presence in the middle east:
"I'd say one in three conversations wound up the same way, basically
that 'America is the Devil.' So I'd ask folks to think about the
Marshall Plan a bit and get back to me. In the end though, I just
had to tell people, 'I'm not having this discussion anymore.'"
"...Think about the Marshall plan a bit and get back to me." Sheer
What this club needs is a Marshall Plan of it's own. Flight, you
said something very poignant in your post--you hadn't had the same
drive to accomplish things or get out there since the Club started to
die. I feel the EXACT same way. Had I not had the encouragement and
help I had when I found the Club back all those summers ago,
iwouldn't be in NEAR the situation I'm in today. And what I've found
is that as you read through these posts and respond to critiques,
criticisms, questions, answers, philosophies, etc., you not only get
more of an understanding from those that are in the business about
how it works, but you get a fire lit under you to do something to be
a part of it.
The key to the old club was networking. Sure, we have all moved on
from those days in some regard. But in this business you should
NEVER stop networking. Most (and close to all) of my industry
contacts to this day came from the old BDC/HC. I'd probably be 25%
of my abilities as a writer today were I not encouraged and critiqued
by other members of this community.
It doesn't have to be over. Fitz is right, we've still got a pretty
solid base of members here. If you are occasionally floating in/out,
lurking, whatever, POST SOMETHING. All it takes is a little to get
it started. I remember the good ol' days when in the time it would
take me to respond to a post there would be ten more posts than when
I started. Post movie reviews, questions, anything to light the
fire. I can think of five threads at least from the past three years
of being a member that I have incorporated the ideas of into my
writing. And I'm talking the occasional threads that went WAY off
the beaten path of writing/filmmaking into politics, morality,
religion, etc. That was part of the fun.
The best we can do is try. Anyone have any other suggestions? I'd
like to get this all up and running again, if only to help others as
much as I've been helped.
Yeah, Goose, I'd have to agree with a lot of what you
said about Matrix Reloaded. I too like the story that
developed, but not necessarily the development itself.
I would like to have seen more character development
for the supporting cast, less guy-who-replaced-Tank
mugging for the camera (I call him Jar-Jar), and I
certainly didn't need that prolonged dance scene in
Zion! It really felt like the studio system had its
hooks in whereas the original film they left alone
because they didn't really know what it was about.
I am waiting with baited breath for Revolutions. I
have an idea as to where this is going, but one thing
you can say for the series is that it's not always
I think it's going to be much easier to appreciate
this film more once the third part is released. This
seemed half-done. Not like Empire Strikes Back, if
you'll pardon the inevitable comparison, which while
being a middle film still tells its own story.
I think they could have done much more, like showing
us Neo rescuing this kid, instead of just pushing into
the background just so they could jump into the
action. I'm sure there will be a director's cut at
some point that will be loaded with expository scenes,
removed for fear of being overly complicated, or just
so they can sell more DVDs.
Thumbs up though.
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Flight, a few things:
1. I agree with your character assessment and yes, it seems that the
studio REALLY sunk it's teeth into wringing every last potential dime
out of the film. For me the dancing/sex scene was pointless and I
couldn't help but be a little jaded at all the corporate (especially
Cadillac, Jesus Christ in Heaven how much did they pay to be a part
of this thing) sponsorship. I wish there was a way for them to not
do that so blatantly.
2. From what I understand, the second and third film were shot to be
one long film split into two--much like the Lord of the Rings series,
which is why it ended the way it did. I have been reading that they
wanted to leave the frist one open-ended in the same way but the
studio balked at what they wanted. Therefore they ended it kinda-
sorta open ended in the original. I'm babbling now.
3. I also have heard (and again, this is rumor) that the story with
the kid he saved will be revealed in much greater detail in the third
film. My guess? It's going to play into some scenario of Neo dying
(a la Jesus) and the Kid taking over his spot as Watcher-Oeverer.
Okay... In the interest of backing up my original statement about
The Matrix Reloaded, I'll opine a bit in response to Geoff's comments
on why I was less than impressed with the film.
Brian, turn away... I'm sure you don't want to hear it all again! :)
Not to disagree with anyone who liked the movie... Nothing wrong
with that - it's the sequel to one of the best movies to come along,
well... ever. Reloaded is a well-made movie, with lots of glitz and
shine. If you liked it, cool. I'm not trying to be a dickhead
holier-than-thou critic by disliking it. I didn't want to dislike it
and I even hate myself a little for not being able to enjoy it more.
Maybe there's something wrong with me.
I thought the acting was okay. The story was interesting, but
lacking - I'll get to why in a sec. I thought the action sequences
were amazing. But they were also completely lacking.
The problem I had with the action in Reloaded is that while the
sequences were huge, fun, amazingly choreographed rollercoaster
rides, they were each lacking any purpose or meaning. In the first
Matrix, every moment of action carried with it an underlying purpose,
a need to win, a struggle for something larger unseen - that was
being outwardly illustrated in the struggles through fistfights and
gun battles. The story of the original Matrix itself made the action
completely necessary, in fact. Neo's character and growth, the
entire struggle to master the intricacies of the Matrix, all of this
was woven through every sequence of action. It brought us somewhere
different and important than when the action started and moved the
story up another notch, and then another.
Reloaded didn't do that. The action was filler virtually every time.
I have some notes from a John Truby seminar that Dark was kind enough
to share with me. In them he noted... "Action is not the same as
plot. Two guys fighting is action, but it actually stops the plot
until we see who wins."
For all the punching and kicking in Reloaded, not only was the "plot"
stopped for overlong periods of time to cram all the slow motion kung
fu in, but nobody ever really wins anything in the end. At the
conclusion of an action scene, like the one with 100 Smiths, no
progression in character or story has been made. It's a draw, and by
extension, the whole story is a draw. I realize it's the middle
movie in a trilogy, so a resolution is still pending, but it should
still succeed in cranking up the conflict, in telling its own story,
but it doesn't IMO. Most of the action felt convoluted and overly
planned out. The story had no point until the end, the characters no
purpose but to ram their dialogue-driven theology into our heads over
and over. They "video-gamed" the movie. The action, while visually
astounding, had no point, no underlying purpose. It was punch, kick,
punch, kick, defeat boss with special move, rinse, repeat.
The most glaring example of my gripe with the pointless action was
the fight between Neo and the Guardian. When the action suddenly
kicked off, I was strangely reminded of that Ultimate Power website
which declares that Ninjas are mammals, that they kill people all the
time, and they like to flip out and fight for no reason.
Neo is such a physically strong hero now that he is never in any real
danger. There is rarely any tenseness in his battles, only visual
flair and lots and lots of bullet time. Only the struggles of his
comrades, which are, unfortunately, as meaningless as Neo's as they
are rooted to his own struggles, can carry any semblance of danger.
The directors figured this out actually (a little too late), and
threw in an obvious complication to get Neo away from everyone else
so there could actually be some sense of danger with Trinity and
Morpheus during the freeway action even though no underlying purpose
to their plight was present.
I've heard some say that those who didn't like the movie weren't
smart enough to get it. That if I had understood it, I would've
liked it. While I can't claim to have understood every facet of the
film during my viewing, I can't imagine anyone not "getting it" when,
as Geoff pointed out, the same things were being hammered into our
heads over and over again in only slightly different ways. In that
sense, what there is to "get" isn't granted to us until the very
ending anyway. Until then, there is no real purpose to the story
being told in this way. The end is supposed to justify the means,
but by the time I reached the end, I'd already spent that
considerable time not caring about the means and not caring about any
single one of the people.
In fact Neo himself declares he has no purpose until the Oracle tells
him to find the Keymaster of Goser (or rather, the Keymaker of the
Matrix). Another moment where the film seemed "video-gamed." While
finding a purpose can be a purpose in and of itself, it's a pretty
thin one, and we as the audience are carried along with him in his
aimlessness for the first half of the film, with everything stemming
from it all action and speechifying saturated in the same
The film relies so heavily on the setup of the first movie that I
found I needed to keep referring back to it to keep grounded during
my viewing of the second one. That's fine, but the problem was at
the end of the first movie, Neo has a purpose. He has a distinct
plan which he lays out quite clearly:
"I know you're out there. I can feel you now. I know that you're
afraid... afraid of us. You're afraid of change. I don't know the
future. I didn't come here to tell you how this is going to end. I
came here to tell how it's going to begin. I'm going to hang up this
phone, and then show these people what you don't want them to see.
I'm going to show them a world without you. A world without rules or
controls, borders or boundaries. A world where anything is possible.
Where we go from there is a choice I leave to you."
But when Reloaded is loaded, he has no purpose any more. We're just
supposed to forget the first movie ended that way. That Neo was
strong, virtually impervious and purposeful. Now Neo is lost and in
need of the Oracle to tell him what his goal is. And the audience
ends up lost and aimless along with him. He didn't need someone to
tell him the future when he said that, but he was still purposeful.
Yet now he isn't. I guess he can find a bunch of people to fight in
Speaking of fights, back to the battle with 100 Smiths, some
interesting information is given regarding the theology of the
Matrix, programs, and the nature of Smith, for example. So one might
argue that the story DOES progress after the action there. But the
directors have confused their theology with story because it has no
grounding or point whatsoever until the end comes along to justify it.
That's the biggest problem I had. It was a unique story, but a story
that was only told during the last 20 minutes of the film. I didn't
feel the last 20 minutes of purpose and information justified the
aimlessness and stagnancy of the first two hours.
And so, that is my gripe with the film in a nutshell. As Flight
said, it doesn't tell its own story. And not only that, but it
doesn't even start telling ANY story until the movie is pretty much
Other gripes - again, just my opinions - in no particular order.
Virtually all of the action sequences ran way too long IMO. If there
was more of a purpose to the action, something riding on the outcome
of the struggle, then it might have felt more worthwhile and I
wouldn't have been checking my watch. But as it was, it felt like
watching somebody playing a punch and kick video game while their
avatar had the invincibly cheat enabled.
The entire sequence at the restaurant bugged me. It felt disjointed
from the movie, like an odd vignette better suited as one of their
Animatrix shorts. Already I was losing my grounding within the film
and this part just launched everything into the clouds. The sequence
with Parsiphany and Neo and the "kiss" was forced and generally lame
as well. I expect they're trying to set up aspects of her character
as emotion-starved, perhaps she will be revealed as the Mother of the
Matrix, the human-interaction emotion program responsible for
discovering the importance of "choice" within human nature, but I
found the kiss moment officially dumb.
Speaking of Parsiphany and whatever-the-other-guy's-name-is, they
reminded me of the bad guys in Hudson Hawk - over the top,
otherworldly, and unnecessarily strange. Again, felt forced.
I thought Zion as presented in the first film more as an "idea"
than as a place we actually see was much more effective than the
place we see in Reloaded. All the stuff in Zion slowed the film down
to a crawl, and nothing about it made it feel like a place worth
saving. I did not find it the magical last vestige of humanity it
was described as, but more like a clone of the silly and mindless
people and politicing from Clone Wars - meetings and celibrations,
but with no grounding in the humanity it was supposed to represent.
Perhaps that will end up intentional when the third film rolls
around, but until then, I found it hard to care what happened to any
of those people, even the curious little kid who we are told Neo
saved. He felt like someone I should care about, but I didn't, and
he came across not as a person, but as a story tool a setup to
something that was never visited upon again. I expect he'll save
Neo's bacon in the last film or something. Otherwise, he was just
something jammed into the film as a blatant tie-in to another of the
Animatrix shorts and ended up getting in the way of the movie's
already molasses-like flow.
Just a personal gripe here... One of the things I really dug about
the first film, and the directors themselves bragged about, was the
overall sense of timelessness they deliberately gave to the world
within the Matrix. The exact period, place, or year was always very
non-specific in The Matrix, except that it was in the 20th century as
explained by Smith. The cars were all very non-specific, the cops
wore non-specific uniforms, all hinting at but none representing
either a city or a specific period. In Reloaded, the freeway
sequence, while very cool, completely flushed that whole atmospheric
concept down the toilet. While they went out of their way in the
first film to get no-name cars that were cool, but generic enough not
to point to any specific year or place, in Reloaded they're driving a
brand new Caddy with apparently bullet-proof-lined doors. You know
they tried to keep with that non-specific atmosphere in Reloaded by
referring to locations as "the mountains" and "the city", but by then
they'd already traded that whole concept in for a cool freeway chase
And finally, as mentioned before, too much speechifying. Too much
important-sounding, but ultimately shallow wordsworthing. It was as
if all the dialogue was written by The Sphinx from Mystery Men. From
the overly long action scenes to the extended and redundant dialogue,
it seemed as if the brothers Wachowski didn't want to kill any of
their babies. Nothing was edited down. Rather than one important-
sounding line to make a point, they had to have four different
important-sounding lines to make the same point. And how many
different ways can one man fight 100 clones? How many cool moves can
be packed in? Watch that scene and you'll probably see every last
one of them and then some.
And now, I will shut up and return to the hole from whence I came.
P.S. I've recently been held to the fire for putting too much
pointless action into a script... The Matrix Reloaded was like a
visualization of that very concept to me, and in that sense, it was
immensely helpful in understanding the difference between action and
plot for my future rewrites. Thanks, Matrix Reloaded!
NOW I'm shutting up.
Johnny (The "Two")
Congratulations.... you are now a Moderator! You have been not only
a strong member and friend over the years, but the lifeblood (aka
cheerleader) for the HC for the past few months.
Now it's partly on you to help pump some life back into the group!
Time to step up!
Guys and gals, I look forward to what the future holds for this club!
Thinking of rants even now,
My feeling on Matrix Reloaded is much the same as Johnny's...
If two super powers fight...no one gets hurt...then, what's the point?
It's like the old Kung Fu movies that I attended with my sons, someone kicks
someone in the chest, they bounce right back up, and begin to fight again.
If someone were to kick me in the chest, I'm lying on the ground at least
three days trying to catch my breath. There's no reality to fight scenes
where everyone walks away with every hair in place.
Just my .02 cents,
Since the beast seems to have risen again I will take
this opportunity to put it to its intended use.
I've had some reasonable success using the HCD book of
producers and I'm looking to find the equivalent of
this but for European and other International
Does anybody know if such a directory exists and if it
does where can one go about purchasing it.
BTW, since we last spoke I've had one of my
screenplays place in the top 20 in the Final Draft
Screenwriting competition and made the semi-finals in
the Chesterfield writing competition.
Since then I've had some production companies ask for
copies and received very favorable reviews but no sale
yet. At least I've made some great contacts.
I'm currently polishing up the latest script that is
more marketable than the last one and hope to have it
out by the end of June.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Goodbye, Adios, Adeus, Arrivederci, Auf Wiedersehen, Au revoir, Sahha
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Donna Caubarreaux wrote:
>My feeling on Matrix Reloaded is much the same as Johnny's...
>If two super powers fight...no one gets hurt...then, what's the point?
>It's like the old Kung Fu movies that I attended with my sons, someone kicks
>someone in the chest, they bounce right back up, and begin to fight again.
>If someone were to kick me in the chest, I'm lying on the ground at least
>three days trying to catch my breath. There's no reality to fight scenes
>where everyone walks away with every hair in place.
>Just my .02 cents,
And a good two cents they are, Donna.
I have a black belt in "old-fashioned" TaeKwon-Do, from back before it
became an Olympic sport. The modern version bears about as much
resemblance to my art as Judo does to the original Ju-Jitsu -- meaning
it's a sport now, with lots of rules and body armor and you can't do
this and that.
But the old-fashioned, hard-line arts (and you can find instructors if
you look for them) are deadly. For my black belt test, I had to kick
through four inches of pine board with a round kick, again with as side
kick, and again with a front kick. Then I broke two bricks with the edge
of my hand, and then again with a punch (knuckles -- 25 years later I
still have those raised knuckles, I'm lucky not to have joint problems
I get a real kick out of watching kung-fu films and epics. I also played
tennis, and enjoy watching clay-court matches, which are boring as hell
if you're not a player. My English girlfriend's brother in law tried to
teach me cricket, another game you have to know to enjoy watching, I
suspect.... But I don't confuse the films with reality.
Nor did my father the state trooper. If you hit someone, make sure you
hit him (A) hard and (B) accurately and (C) hit him again if you don't
take him down the first time. You're right -- if someone like me kicked
you in the chest (more likely the solar plexus or floating ribs) you
would NOT get back up. Three days? Try healing in hospital if you're lucky.
Just ONCE I'd like to see a realistic scene where the guy gets pummeled
and ends up in traction instead of calling up his willpower and moral
superiority and rising to defeat the X number of bad guys!
Still, it's entertainment. I never did learn that kung-fu flying stance
to go cruising above the treetops...
"[So] that was war. Just about all he could find in its favor was that it paid
well and liberated children from the pernicious influence of their parents." -
What I found to be wrong with the action sequences in
Reloaded was the lack of a sotry-line within the
fight. Except the freeway scene which actually did
have a narrative.
Despite the Clone Wars bash that appeared in this
string (ahem), I'm going to draw this comparison: The
pod race scene in Phantom Menace. When this film came
out, everyone loved this sequence, regardless of how
they felt about the rest of the movie. It was new and
broke a lot of ground in spfx.
When the film was released on DVD, George Lucas had
completed the sequence he'd run out of time to create
originally. This newer version told a story, the race
had high-points and low, setbacks for the hero,
suspense and an outcome, and because of this it was
much more than just a spectacular roller-coaster
My point being this: It was posed that action
interrupts plot, which in many cases is quite true,
but because of this I feel it is necessary to ensure
there is a beginning middle and end to the fight's
story. Almost a play within a play. I think as
writers/directors/producers/what-have-you, no matter
what the genre, we could all do well to keep this in
Zion did not seem real to me either. It was too
Mad-Maxish. I imagined it being more like... Well,
something along the lines of Old New York in Futurama!
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Thank you, HC faithful! I would like to thank God and my keyboard,
two folks without whose help I would not be here today. It's good to
know I'm finally a Mod now that...no one...seems to post...anymore.
No I'm kidding! Good to see a min-rejuvination here lately! i look
forward to keeping up. And thanks for the props from all.
Now go ahead, ask me a bunch of questions so I can find out the
answers from Dark.
Talk to the 8 Ball,
PS--I think this message has been sent through once already, so if
this is a duplicate, I apologize. johnny, I just wanted to let you
know I replied in LENGTH to your Matrix post from the other night.
Sadly, my internet connection went down the second I hit "Send" and
all was lost. I will summarize in a moment my thoughts.
Congrats on your success Randy, and great to hear from you!
My first stop would be over at scriptsales.com (Done Deal) ebcause
they have a massive directory of production companies. I'm not sure
if they list international operatives there, but you might give it a
If that fails, I would contact George Kingsnorth, a member of this
club. He works out of Northern Ireland mostly and could at least
direct you in the way of one of those...er, directories...if he can't
get you the info himself. I've asked George for tips on several
occasions (specifically those dealing with DV) and he's been a great
I'll tell you what, man...Pixar knows how to score, that's for sure.
Though it might not have been quite as witty as Monsters Inc. this
was a great, great little movie. I just can't even fathom how they
keep banging out hits like this (Note: I'm sleepy and I mistyped
both "hits" and "this" and that sentence, and neither looked off to
One thing I'm amazed they've been able to do so many times is get
scripts together that appeal to kids on one level and adults on a
completely separate one. This could spawn an interesting topic--can
double-metaphor be pulled off like that through hard work or just
through innante ability? Discuss.
I have to say I enjoyed this more than both Bruce Almighty and The
Matrix. See if you have kids, see it if you don't, but for God's
sake, if you're the father of a son, it's your duty to take him to
see it. I called my dad afterwards, no joke.
--- In email@example.com, goosejmu22
> PS--I think this message has been sent through once already, so if
> this is a duplicate, I apologize. johnny, I just wanted to let you
> know I replied in LENGTH to your Matrix post from the other night.
> Sadly, my internet connection went down the second I hit "Send" and
> all was lost. I will summarize in a moment my thoughts.
Well, in general my thoughts aren't worth replying to anyway. It was
kind of a rant, and I failed to mention that despite all that, I
still had a good time watching the film. Would your summarized
response consist of, quite simply, "I liked Reloaded. So shut up and
By the way, congrats on going Mod. Of course, nowadays they call
Johnny (Goth Talk)
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