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Re: [elfling] Sequencing of Tengwar & Tehtar   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #1884 of 6797 |
[elfscript] Re: odd tehta in DTS 41


xeeniseit wrote:

>I didn't know that, but as far as I know, at least all (published) phonemic=
>
>
>tengwar samples make that distinction.

I'm not saying that he never made such a distinction, of course, I'm
just saying that he very frequently did not. The distinction seems
to have been made more often in modes in which vowels are represented
by full letters than in "tehta modes".

>(OT: By the way, do you know if there's still any possibility to get that a=
>
>rticle of
>yours?)

According to the _Parma Eldalamberon_ website, issue #13 is currently
out of stock.

>In what word did Tolkien make that use?

It wasn't actually in a word, but rather in a discussion of how to
represent English vowel sounds by means of tehtar, where he describes
the sound in question as the "er" sound, specifically <i>, <e>, and
<u> when they occur before <r>, pronounced as schwa. This would mean
words like "bird", "stern", and "burn", though Tolkien doesn't give
any sample words.

> He seems to have hesitated on how
>to write that sound, in full writing modes sometimes represented by short
>carrier, óre; sometimes by óre + andaith; and if not stressed, by óre alone=

This last option is also presented in the aforementioned document
from ca. 1968.

I wouldn't necessarily say "hesitated", though. Tolkien liked to
tinker with his languages and alphabets -- certainly the multiplicity
of tengwar modes can attest to that -- and we are the richer for it.
If Tolkien had been satisfied with the very first version of the
Alphabet of Rúmil and never invented another Elvish alphabet, there
would be precious little traffic on the elfscript list!

Cheers!

Arden

--
*********************************************************************
Arden R. Smith erilaz@...

Perilme metto aimaktur perperienta.
--Elvish proverb
*********************************************************************



Sat Mar 15, 2003 7:37 pm

erilaz7
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Message #1884 of 6797 |
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... Almost. For the word _harma_ use the tengwa hyarmen to write 'h'. Once upon a time, initial 'h' was written with harma, but it had been replaced by hyarmen...
DDanielA@...
uialdil
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Mar 12, 2003
6:28 pm

I've found a tehta I didn't know in DTS 41, the "Envelope Doodles", Artist & Illustrator no. 186. It's a tehta that looks like an inverted acute accent...
xeeniseit
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Mar 12, 2003
7:18 pm

... I do agree with that. However, I don't believe that there's necessarily any clear distinction here between schwa and the vowel in "but". The...
Arden R. Smith
erilaz7
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Mar 13, 2003
4:51 am

... My dictionary tells me the same thing, but I imagine that in exaggerated or at least very emphatic pronunciation, the last vowel of "gladiolus" could be...
xeeniseit
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Mar 13, 2003
2:40 pm

... Certainly. ... I assume that you meant "placed under the silme", but yes, I think that's true. Perhaps it's simply *because* of such a possible confusion...
Arden R. Smith
erilaz7
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Mar 14, 2003
8:30 pm

Arden R. Smith wrote: >xeeniseit wrote: >>Imagine the word with a dot underneath instead of the grave >>accent: that dot would be placed under the lambe, but...
xeeniseit
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Mar 15, 2003
11:08 am

... I'm not saying that he never made such a distinction, of course, I'm just saying that he very frequently did not. The distinction seems to have been made...
Arden R. Smith
erilaz7
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Mar 15, 2003
7:33 pm

Arden R. Smith wrote: > >I didn't know that, but as far as I know, at least all (published) > >phonemic tengwar samples make that distinction. > > I'm not...
xeeniseit
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Mar 17, 2003
10:04 pm
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